|
Post by JB on Jul 26, 2024 14:09:02 GMT -5
funny meme but Russ was an effective player for the Clippers before they traded for Harden. Melo was 25 ppg scorer for the Knicks before he joined OKC...OKC destroyed him right? Russ last decent stint was 2 years ago against PHX in the 1st round when both PG13 and Kawhi was hurt and he was one man show (OKC Russ). Evidence of Russ being effective in the role he would be asked to play here (Reggie/Bruce role) is non existent. And his last playoff showing vs Mavs was so bad even the Clippers did not wanted him back on that vet deal. Never liked him as a basketball player, he only knows how to play with 100% reckless abandon 24/7 and that's it. You are not going to change him here. Will do my best to root for the guy because he is a Nugget now, but once again, player option and no alternative option in case he fails (buyout market Malcom Brogdon). To much gamble with prime Jokic. the more appropriate analogy is Portland era Melo, which he was by all accounts an effective role player and good vet presence. I don't want Russ to change. I want Malone to return to his hockey shift lineup roots and never stagger again. I want Murray and Joker on the floor together at all times, with Russ driving and dishing to Saric and Strawther with Watson running the floor and erasing defensive mistakes. this will solve multiple problems for us.
|
|
|
Post by JB on Jul 26, 2024 14:11:15 GMT -5
here's the breakdown of the playoffs to reinforce my point that context is essential:
Harden ON Westbrook ON 78 minutes -6.44 Netrtg
Harden ON Westbrook OFF 162 minutes -13.98 Netrtg (woof)
Westbrook ON Harden OFF 35 minutes 8.11 Netrtg
|
|
|
Post by Dante on Jul 26, 2024 14:11:43 GMT -5
So...there goes even the slim chance of cutting Russ if (when) he is more trouble and negative product on the court and eventually picking up (targeting) Brogdon at trade deadline as a guy who will 1000% be bought out. Nuggets front office ladies and gentleman... Brogdon can’t play alongside Murray and will be wanting more than a 15 minute/game role and will prefer a team that may want him next season at something in the MLE range. “Targeting” a guy doesn’t mean he’ll think the Nuggets are a good opportunity. Would rather take a gamble of CB and Strawther developing and playing with Jamal and within the system that we built for so many years instead of Russ taking over the rains. Given Jamal ego/temper and the same goes for Russ i can see a situation where they bump heads more often than not on and off the floor. Targeting a guy or not, giving Russ a freaking PLAYER OPTION at this stage he is at and especially the stage WE ARE AT is LUNACY. I have nothing against signing Russ. They wanted him, they "Targeted" him. Ok. Good. Let's see. BUT PLAYER OPTION? WHY? Where is the leverage? Gonna need to use 2031 1st to get rid of him in case he is cancer both on and off the floor? That's my problem. Player option. Nothing else.
|
|
|
Post by Dante on Jul 26, 2024 14:14:04 GMT -5
here's the breakdown of the playoffs to reinforce my point that context is essential: Harden ON Westbrook ON 78 minutes -6.44 Netrtg Harden ON Westbrook OFF 162 minutes -13.98 Netrtg (woof) Westbrook ON Harden OFF 35 minutes 8.11 Netrtg You should delete this post my friend. Because if i post Russ numbers in that Mavs series you would look foolish. Netrtg...rofl
|
|
|
Post by LotharBraunBrownBryant on Jul 26, 2024 14:15:11 GMT -5
That's my problem. Player option. Nothing else. A player option on a minimum contract is essentially meaningless. It's just injury insurance. Cutting a guy on a minimum is very easy, particularly due to the reduced cap hit.
|
|
|
Post by JB on Jul 26, 2024 14:16:48 GMT -5
here's the breakdown of the playoffs to reinforce my point that context is essential: Harden ON Westbrook ON 78 minutes -6.44 Netrtg Harden ON Westbrook OFF 162 minutes -13.98 Netrtg (woof) Westbrook ON Harden OFF 35 minutes 8.11 Netrtg You should delete this post my friend. Because if i post Russ numbers in that Mavs series you would look foolish. Netrtg...rofl nobody is arguing Russ did not play unbelievably bad, I am providing context as to why that was the case. Westbrook/Harden together was basketball bubonic plague but unfortunately Ty Lue didn't get the message.
|
|
|
Post by Dante on Jul 26, 2024 14:17:22 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by JB on Jul 26, 2024 14:18:01 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Dante on Jul 26, 2024 14:19:10 GMT -5
That's my problem. Player option. Nothing else. A player option on a minimum contract is essentially meaningless. It's just injury insurance. Cutting a guy on a minimum is very easy, particularly due to the reduced cap hit. Why did it costed us 3 second round picks to get rid of Reggie then? Explain me please, no sarcasm.
|
|
|
Post by LotharBraunBrownBryant on Jul 26, 2024 14:20:35 GMT -5
A player option on a minimum contract is essentially meaningless. It's just injury insurance. Cutting a guy on a minimum is very easy, particularly due to the reduced cap hit. Why did it costed us 3 second round picks to get rid of Reggie then? Explain me please, no sarcasm. Reggie wasn't on a minimum contract. He was a Taxpayer Midlevel contract.
|
|
|
Post by Dante on Jul 26, 2024 14:21:41 GMT -5
Thanks brother. I will never change xd. You say that you are hoping that Malone will go back to "hockey" shifts/rotations. Me too. But what about playoffs? How do you see Jokic being guarded by 3-4 people at all times while Russ is being guarded by air and CB with defender minimum 4 feet away? Jokic will enjoy that load 100%.
|
|
|
Post by Dante on Jul 26, 2024 14:25:04 GMT -5
Why did it costed us 3 second round picks to get rid of Reggie then? Explain me please, no sarcasm. Reggie wasn't on a minimum contract. He was a Taxpayer Midlevel contract. Ok, got it. Thanks. Now i am even more mad on Booth for using TPMLE on Reggie (only to justify him "Targeting" him in buyout market). Anyway, i hope Russ works out somehow, but i simply dont see how, especially in the playoffs. For regular season he is more than welcome energizer bunny we need on the bench and in team in general but when it comes to REAL basketball, he sucks at it.
|
|
|
Post by Dante on Jul 26, 2024 14:29:59 GMT -5
I understand the excitement you guys have for him with us. We really needed that type of Bruce Brown mental rabbit to energize everyone. But Bruce Brown was major plus in the playoffs, he was making his layups, and making his open 3s at more than acceptable level.
Russell Westbrook last seen in the playoffs was shooting 19% from the field, 15% from 3, 63% from FT and was averaging 1.2 assists and 1.2 turnovers. How is that a selling point for what we need idk...
|
|
|
Post by nuggetshipster on Jul 26, 2024 14:32:24 GMT -5
Attaching 3 picks to dump an expiring contract is still baffling to me. Yes, the player option was a bad idea, but we drastically overpaid to rectify that mistake. Should've dumped Pickett and Tyson instead and kept Reggie and Holiday as your emergency guards. You can write “attaching 3 picks” as often as you want and it doesn’t change the fact that worthless is worthless and it doesn’t much matter whether it’s 3 worthless picks or 100 worthless picks. It’s just moving the player off the roster spot and getting his contract off the cap sheet. Teams can buy those picks for a little cash. And some of the players who are still “on the board” in the 50’s have their agents tell teams not to draft them so they can sign on to a team they like as an undrafted free agent. Nuggets’ fans don’t have to like it but because the team is deep into the lux tax there is tax money tacked on in multiples of the “over the tax money”. So Jackson’s contract for next season would have cost the team somewhere in the $10-20 mil range in actual cash, which is a lot of money to spend for an end of the bench guy. In addition, there has been chatter that Jackson didn’t care about winning as much as Jokic wanted from his teammates. It’s only been a few weeks since the new NBA year officially started so we don’t know what will be with a couple of deep bench spots. Things may still change. wuut
|
|
|
Post by GBG on Jul 26, 2024 14:40:33 GMT -5
Reggie wasn't on a minimum contract. He was a Taxpayer Midlevel contract. Ok, got it. Thanks. Now i am even more mad on Booth for using TPMLE on Reggie (only to justify him "Targeting" him in buyout market). Anyway, i hope Russ works out somehow, but i simply dont see how, especially in the playoffs. For regular season he is more than welcome energizer bunny we need on the bench and in team in general but when it comes to REAL basketball, he sucks at it. You can’t have it both ways. You say you don’t see how Russ works out somehow, yet the reason you hate the deal is the player option. The only reason to dislike the player option is worry about Russ having a surprisingly good year and opting out of second year to grab a bag. So your logic is completely flawed, with all due respect. You can’t be negative about Russ chances of playing well here, AND be negative about Booth giving Russ an option for a better contract in his second year, which only happens if he’s good. As I said earlier, if it takes a player option to motivate Russ at this stage of his career to exceed expectations, it’s a great thing to hand out.
|
|
pie
Monte Towe Benchwarmer
Posts: 77
|
Post by pie on Jul 26, 2024 14:52:18 GMT -5
Calvin "player option" Booth should have been fired a few weeks ago.
It is beyond puzzling and lunacy -- that he cannot get quality free agents to play with the best basketball player in the world and 3-time MVP.
A terrible, terrible contract for 36 year old Russell Westbrick
|
|
pie
Monte Towe Benchwarmer
Posts: 77
|
Post by pie on Jul 26, 2024 14:53:34 GMT -5
We will look back on this era in 5-10 years and blame Josh Kroenke for hiring Calvin Booth and ruining Nikola Jokic's prime.
Calvin Booth has to be the worst GM in the NBA
|
|
|
Post by Dante on Jul 26, 2024 14:57:22 GMT -5
Ok, got it. Thanks. Now i am even more mad on Booth for using TPMLE on Reggie (only to justify him "Targeting" him in buyout market). Anyway, i hope Russ works out somehow, but i simply dont see how, especially in the playoffs. For regular season he is more than welcome energizer bunny we need on the bench and in team in general but when it comes to REAL basketball, he sucks at it. You can’t have it both ways. You say you don’t see how Russ works out somehow, yet the reason you hate the deal is the player option. The only reason to dislike the player option is worry about Russ having a surprisingly good year and opting out of second year to grab a bag. So your logic is completely flawed, with all due respect. You can’t be negative about Russ chances of playing well here, AND be negative about Booth giving Russ an option for a better contract in his second year, which only happens if he’s good. As I said earlier, if it takes a player option to motivate Russ at this stage of his career to exceed expectations, it’s a great thing to hand out. An easy way for the blind to go, a clever path for the fools who know. That is how i see this deal turned out between Booth and Russ (Booth being blind and Russ being a fool). I am in the middle earth on this signing because truth to be told, i don't know how to feel at the moment about him. I am way more sceptical about those foolish and bad basketball things he brings to the table over those energizer, full effort, all out mode that can rip off to others on the team (including Jamal). I feel 100% entitled to be sceptical about Russell Westbrook as all of you should be, no matter which rose colored glasses you are wearing atm.
|
|
|
Post by scooter on Jul 26, 2024 15:26:00 GMT -5
I’m in the group of “I have no idea whether Westbrook will be a net positive contributor on the Nuggets.” I absolutely know he’ll have bad games. I absolutely know he’ll put up some shots we wished he hadn’t taken. But there are many unknowns about his future Nuggets’ tenure and we’ll just have to wait and see. I think he has particular strengths the team likes adding — rebounding, free throws, pace, toughness. We just have to hope Malone uses him well and that Westbrook’s strengths complement his lineups.
I think rebounding and pace are the positives that management was most interested in addressing. We all know that the Jokic/Murray game is one of the slowest in the league, but it works because overall shooting percentages are high and turnovers are low. I think the thing that made management highly motivated to ship Jackson out was that his game was just as slow as Murray’s. The relentlessly slow pace is costing the Nuggets some of their home court advantage.
The other thing that drove Malone crazy last season was the bench groups getting murdered on the glass. We all remember the late season Mavs’ game. Assuming no major injuries, the team should have more playable size next season and in addition, Westbrook’s rebounding rate numbers have held up so far. So on paper they’ve addressed that.
So I get it. But will Braun and Strawther play well enough (and stay healthy enough) to keep Westbrook from playing alongside Murray? I hope so. Will Westbrook find ways to not be too much of a negative in half court sets? I hope so. Don’t really know. I just know the team wanted to try an experiment that’s very different than what they had with RJ last season.
|
|
|
Post by BBBbbb on Jul 26, 2024 15:38:10 GMT -5
I think we’re all (including me) trying to talk ourselves into this Westbrook thing possibly working out, as it is probably our only chance of being a title contender this season.
|
|