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Post by famicommander on Jun 1, 2024 14:01:47 GMT -5
It’s a thin line. On one hand you want to immediately cut down such hateful and damaging claims, and come down harsh. On the other hand you are creating a dangerous framework that can be misused for going after people that just don’t share your opinion. You want examples of things being misused in similar way look at how Israel government weaponized antisemitism. Again, trying to connect the dots between private individuals holding actual bigots accountable in the real world and an authoritarian government weaponizing censorship against citizens is ridiculous. Everyone can see the difference between actual antisemitism and criticizing the government of Israel's genocide against Palestine. The people who conflate the two are doing so intentionally and disingenuously, so it's a waste of time to make allowances for them. The people who try to use antisemitism as a shield against the criticism of Israel know god damn well their argument is hollow, and they know everybody else knows it too. By humoring them you don't disempower them, all you do is stop other people from standing up to actual bigots.
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Post by BBBbbb on Jun 1, 2024 14:16:28 GMT -5
It’s a thin line. On one hand you want to immediately cut down such hateful and damaging claims, and come down harsh. On the other hand you are creating a dangerous framework that can be misused for going after people that just don’t share your opinion. You want examples of things being misused in similar way look at how Israel government weaponized antisemitism. Again, trying to connect the dots between private individuals holding actual bigots accountable in the real world and an authoritarian government weaponizing censorship against citizens is ridiculous. Everyone can see the difference between actual antisemitism and criticizing the government of Israel's genocide against Palestine. The people who conflate the two are doing so intentionally and disingenuously, so it's a waste of time to make allowances for them. The people who try to use antisemitism as a shield against the criticism of Israel know god damn well their argument is hollow, and they know everybody else knows it too. By humoring them you don't disempower them, all you do is stop other people from standing up to actual bigots. Quite a few people in US lost their high profile jobs due to criticism of Israel’s government, so not sure I agree - everyone can see… We all live in our social bubbles, that might prevent us to see the realistic picture. P.S. not even for criticism but in some cases for not coming down hard on people doing the criticism (Unis)
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Post by famicommander on Jun 1, 2024 14:17:57 GMT -5
Again, trying to connect the dots between private individuals holding actual bigots accountable in the real world and an authoritarian government weaponizing censorship against citizens is ridiculous. Everyone can see the difference between actual antisemitism and criticizing the government of Israel's genocide against Palestine. The people who conflate the two are doing so intentionally and disingenuously, so it's a waste of time to make allowances for them. The people who try to use antisemitism as a shield against the criticism of Israel know god damn well their argument is hollow, and they know everybody else knows it too. By humoring them you don't disempower them, all you do is stop other people from standing up to actual bigots. Quite a few people in US lost their high profile jobs due to criticism of Israel’s government, so not sure I agree - everyone can see… We all live in our social bubbles, that might prevent us to see the realistic picture. Again, those people who fired those people know the truth. They are not misinformed, they are aware of the immorality of their actions and choosing to undertake them anyway. Stopping yourself from criticizing actual bigots doesn't help those people who got fired and it doesn't teach the evil people who fired them a lesson either.
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Post by LotharBraunBrownBryant on Jun 1, 2024 14:31:46 GMT -5
Authoritarians of all stripes love to flatten out distinctions, so that they can weaponize the strongest enforcement mechanisms that are meant for things like treason and mafia stuff and deploy them against ordinary critics. One of the most important defenses against that is to insist on not flattening out distinctions.
When I say that Kyrie's anti-Semitic comments are very wrong, and that I would cancel my own tickets if he came to Denver, that's not a call for government crackdown of protesters. That's not a call for arrest or prosecution. That's not a call for Kyrie to be banned from the league. That's not a call for bombing Palestinian civilians. It's just me saying I'm not going to pay money to go cheer for that guy because his ideas are vile. Don't make what I say into something it's not.
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Post by BBBbbb on Jun 1, 2024 14:34:28 GMT -5
Fami although we share views on some political topics your intensity is at times overwhelming to have a discussion, so I’ll try to elaborate once more and then stop.
I gave an example of fight against antisemitism as something being weaponized to do harm.
Most of the people anywhere in the world don’t want to go deep into politics. They will consume some amount of it from the mainstream media (Include social networks here as well) and stop there. That is the majority. Same way many western people see the help for Ukraine as help to save those people from Russian aggression, there is a majority of people in Russia the war as trying to protect the Russian people living in Ukraine. (Nazi) Paramilitary forces like Avzov and Wagner just feed into the other side’s narrative.
Strong fight against antisemitism was necessary after WWII, because that s**t did not start with Hitler (whether it’s Italy in the 10th or Spain in 15th century, or many other occasions), it had to be cut quickly not to resurrect. And what we see now is that mechanism being misused to silence and cancel people.
Majority accepts what they see in media and that is it. Tiktok is getting banned because it’s not under control of US government…
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Post by famicommander on Jun 1, 2024 14:47:57 GMT -5
Fami although we share views on some political topics your intensity is at times overwhelming to have a discussion, so I’ll try to elaborate once more and then stop. I gave an example of fight against antisemitism as something being weaponized to do harm. Most of the people anywhere in the world don’t want to go deep into politics. They will consume some amount of it from the mainstream media (Include social networks here as well) and stop there. That is the majority. Same way many western people see the help for Ukraine as help to save those people from Russian aggression, there is a majority of people in Russia the war as trying to protect the Russian people living in Ukraine. (Nazi) Paramilitary forces like Avzov and Wagner just feed into the other side’s narrative. Strong fight against antisemitism was necessary after WWII, because that s**t did not start with Hitler (whether it’s Italy in the 10th or Spain in 15th century, or many other occasions), it had to be cut quickly not to resurrect. And what we see now is that mechanism being misused to silence and cancel people. Majority accepts what they see in media and that is it. Tiktok is getting banned because it’s not under control of US government… Your example is not relevant. It's an apples to oranges comparison. You're saying that because some disingenuous actors weaponize anti-bigotry for nefarious purposes we shouldn't ever practice anti-bigotry, essentiially. That's like saying because some nutjobs run people over with cars, nobody should ever drive anywhere. Once again, the people perpetrating these nefarious acts will not in any way change their behaviors if you or I decide to criticize bigots less. All you're doing is making the world better for bigots and worse for the targets of their bigotry. Me and Lothar not calling Kyrie a dumbass antisemite would in absolutely no way help any of the people who are currently being victimized by Israel or because of their criticism of Israel. All it would do would be to allow his antisemitism to go unopposed.
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Post by BBBbbb on Jun 1, 2024 14:59:52 GMT -5
Where did I say it should not be done? Now you sound like Erik reading what you want not what is written.
I said it’s a thin line. I said strong fight against antisemitism was necessary at some point.
It requires balance in sometimes more tactical approach, not just using a sledgehammer on everything, because then you can expect it will be used on you at some point.
I called for the tate guy to be banned as well, because it’s promoting a harmful scammer and at that time maybe even known human trafficker and rapist. But fami you cannot go against everything with a sledgehammer.
Irving is dumb and selfish. Not sure to what extent he’s antisemitic and to what just an a dumb person that stumbled on a wrong video. Kanye is a person with a mental illness that is being taken advantage of left and right… he too big of a cash cow to be left to an institution. That is my view on those two…
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Post by LotharBraunBrownBryant on Jun 1, 2024 15:08:22 GMT -5
are you accusing anyone specific on this board of going after Kyrie with a "sledgehammer" in your analogy? Who specifically, and what do you think is disproportionate? Do you think it's disproportionate for me to say that I wouldn't pay money to go cheer for Kyrie being on the Nuggets, because I think his views are bigoted and wrong? Or are you presuming something other than what I said, turning the presumption into something disproportionate and sledgehammer-like that maybe someone somewhere else believes but isn't what any of us said, and then criticizing that position?
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Post by BBBbbb on Jun 1, 2024 15:22:50 GMT -5
are you accusing anyone specific on this board of going after Kyrie with a "sledgehammer" in your analogy? Who specifically, and what do you think is disproportionate? Do you think it's disproportionate for me to say that I wouldn't pay money to go cheer for Kyrie being on the Nuggets, because I think his views are bigoted and wrong? Or are you presuming something other than what I said, turning the presumption into something disproportionate and sledgehammer-like that maybe someone somewhere else believes but isn't what any of us said, and then criticizing that position? No, the discussion moved from Kyrie specific a few pages ago. I passed on getting a Kyrie’s signature shoes a few times, when I saw at the shop it had his logo, although I liked the design. Individual acts are fine. I am against just calling immediately for canceling/banning as an approach when someone does something wrong, and first try with a more tactical approach. Saying you don’t want ti pay for seeing him play is far far from a sledgehammer, that is an individual act. Hell I don’t buy quite a few products and services as I don’t agree with their policies.
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Post by duh88 on Jun 1, 2024 20:10:31 GMT -5
Fami and GBG running the usual dnc talking points:
Black people are gods - unless they claim the first Jews were black (thus undermining Israel’s entire argument for existence and justification for genociding palestinians).
Never change, dnc fan-boys. Never change.
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Post by famicommander on Jun 1, 2024 20:38:56 GMT -5
Fami and GBG running the usual dnc talking points: Black people are gods - unless they claim the first Jews were black (thus undermining Israel’s entire argument for existence and justification for genociding palestinians). Never change, dnc fan-boys. Never change. Do you take it as a personal challenge to make sure you always have the absolute dumbest post in any possible discussion? I don't even vote, and if I did it would be for a libertarian. DNC talking points? Since when has the DNC cared about Palestinians? Joe Biden is to the right of George Bush on that particular issue.
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Post by duh88 on Jun 2, 2024 4:45:05 GMT -5
Regarding Nuggets Off-Season:
I'm with Scooter.
Our team can beat size - but we're not built for it. We're built to beat wing-heavy teams (celtics, warriors, suns, mavs etc). We can beat size (Minny, LA) - but it takes a bite out of us. Couple that with Murray being hurt and starters being ran into the ground - it's not a surprising outcome. But to say that our core isn't the BEST in the nba? Foolish to think that. If we're healthy, we're destroying the Mavs and the Celtics right now.
The bench needs help, and a little magic, since the budget is equal to a jar of peanuts. We need a backup center and we need a scorer off the bench.
For backup Center, we need someone who can ball every night (not break glass in case of emergency: DJ). We need: Willie Cauley Stein
Give WCS the vet minimum - and let him just be the wrecking ball that he's meant to be with the second unit - its akin to when the Bulls brought in Rodman in order to stop Shaq. If not WCS, then trade 2nd's again for Thomas Bryant, or consider Christian Wood, Xavier Tillman, or James Wiseman. Bargain options that will be good enough for 10 to 15 competent mins nightly.
As for a scorer off the bench - Julian Strawther - beautiful floater - will have a much better second year - he'll be stronger too. All he has to do is drive into the paint 10 to 15 times per game. A long-armed center like WCS will rebound a decent amount of the misses. The mix will be good enough to keep heat on opposing second-units.
Please god do not bring in a center with small arms who cannot rebound (yes, this comment is directed at Mason Plumlee fans). Trade Reggie and Zeke, open up the money needed... and let's f***ing go!!!!
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Post by nuggetshipster on Jun 4, 2024 4:10:55 GMT -5
Yeah, and someone who wants me to know how "woke" he is and how he discovered the "truth" that's actually horribly racist ... is someone I would cancel my season tickets over. I oppose hate speech, whether it's spoken out of malice or mere foolish ignorance. Let's not pretend it's bad to oppose hate speech if the guy can ball. I believe in free speech unless you have a documented history of directly advocating harm towards a certain group (which Kyrie does not), not exceptionalism for celebrities or athletes. I remember arguing against basically all of NT against banning the Andrew Tate fan on the principle that we shouldn't exile people for the crime of endorsing certain wacky views and human beings possess the capacity for growth. and look, he returned as benny and was an asset to the community. so yeah, many people endorse bat-s**t crazy views but we live in a society as George Costanza once said and should lead with dialogue. This
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Post by nuggetshipster on Jun 4, 2024 4:17:09 GMT -5
Where did I say it should not be done? Now you sound like Erik reading what you want not what is written. This isnt true tho. Just people saying they ment something else than what they said or wrote. Also comparing him to me is a pretty effective domination technique. Please provide evidence for your claim
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Post by scooter on Jun 5, 2024 14:02:07 GMT -5
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Post by TNF on Jun 6, 2024 19:50:14 GMT -5
No comments yet?
Classy tribute for Walton, eventuallybeven including a Dead song. I consider Walton a Blazer but he was all over.
...and at Red Rocks...
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Post by GBG on Jun 6, 2024 20:01:16 GMT -5
No comments yet? Classy tribute for Walton, eventuallybeven including a Dead song. I consider Walton a Blazer but he was all over. ...and at Red Rocks... And on the UCLA campus, where he (unintentionally) knocked the schoolbooks out of my hands between classes. Old folks like repeating themselves, and I’m sure I told that story before. Will have to watch that tribute on YouTube.
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Post by GBG on Jun 6, 2024 20:04:38 GMT -5
Porzingas looks rested and healed up, that’s for sure.
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Post by somborshuffle on Jun 6, 2024 20:06:37 GMT -5
Zinger is awesome.
He's the Celtics x-factor that made them so freaking good this year.
A legit all-star caliber big.
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Post by JB on Jun 6, 2024 20:17:37 GMT -5
Porzingis f***ing around and winning Finals MVP would be an amazing outcome that absolutely no one saw coming.
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